Less is More or Less

Upload and discuss your songs here. Open for Jazz and Rock, too!
Forum rules
Please do not upload songs protected by 3rd party copyright!
Post Reply
User avatar
VikingBlues
Posts: 4466
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:44 pm

Less is More or Less

Post by VikingBlues »

I had meant to 'celebrate' the second anniversary of my joining the 12bar forum with revisiting / reworking an old recording. :beer:

But due to the old memory ( :oldie: ) not firing 100% I missed the date by nearly a couple of weeks.

So, later than I meant to, I've picked a recording / BT from about two years ago. One that is quite laid back - which suited my mood very late last night.
The original thread on this - A piece called 'Trying for Less' based on a BT of ZZ Top Blue Jean Blues:-
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=245
At that time it was a new type of sound and style for me - one of those 'on the brink of something new' feelings you get in the learning process. Always gives me a slightly panicky feeling when that happens - the fear that I'm going to lose my grip on the new knowledge / ability. The recording got well received on Soundclick - in the top 3 I've done of % downloads v listens.

I'd not heard my original for a while - so I'm interested how similarthe new version is. Like a crossword where the first thought that enters the head makes it difficult to think of anything else, I think once you've worked on a BT the recording you produce is lodged in the memory to the extent it's difficult not to go down the same sort of tracks - even after a couple of years.

New Version : Less is More or Less : download/file.php?id=1488

Old Version : Trying for Less : download/file.php?id=1489

I hear some more fluidity in phrasing now and I think it sounds a bit less leaden. Currently I prefer the tone (even if there is a little buzz) of the PRS / P90 / Tonelab LE combination to the Hagstrom / Humbucker / Blackstar Drive / Tonelab ST from 2 years ago. I suspect in a couple of years time my tastes in tone will have changed again though. :icon_whoknows:

In the attachments below the old version is the top one, the new version at the bottom.
Attachments


Trying for Less - from 2 years ago
Trying For Less BmSlowBlues.mp3 - (3.54 MiB)


Less is More or Less - the new inprov
Less is More or Less.mp3 - (3.54 MiB)

An improv a day keeps the demons at bay!
User avatar
tytlblues
Posts: 1303
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2011 3:34 am

Re: Less is More or Less

Post by tytlblues »

Hey VB, I do like the phrasing and overall melody of the new, but....think I like the sound , tone of the first one. Little more girth to the old versions tone for my ear. Also, seems like the old version, while I agree maybe not as "Fluid" I like some of the old versions bends better....little more soulful! :music2:
Tytlblues

"Notes are expensive... spend them wisely”
BB King
User avatar
VikingBlues
Posts: 4466
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:44 pm

Re: Less is More or Less

Post by VikingBlues »

Thanks for the listen tytl. :thumbsup:

Yes - it's funny how the 'moment' can affect the recording so much - as does mood. I think the wonderment I was feeling on the original version when I was hearing these new things in my playing managed to communicate itself. Technical shortcomings are more than balanced by the 'soul' when that communication works right. I wish I could bottle that feeling and use it when needed. :alright:
An improv a day keeps the demons at bay!
User avatar
Strummer07
Posts: 671
Joined: Thu Apr 08, 2010 3:59 pm

Re: Less is More or Less

Post by Strummer07 »

Firstly Congrats on two years at 12 bar !!
2 tracks .. 2 years apart .....good idea !

TBh they are both examples of some nice playing .... lots of echo's in the way you interpreted the BT ...but it is a pretty "Definate" BT .. I'm not sure it lends itself to wildly different ways of playing, unless you played over it in double time?????? ( but what do I know!!)

Like tyiblues I like the 1st offering very much .. different set up .. rougher , edgier tone , overall a more Raucous feeling

as to the actual playing ...its really quite tough to differentiate ........perhaps a more staccotto way of playing in the older version.

a darker/ moodier feel maybe .......and looking hard for something !! Perhaps a bit more ponderous and thoughtful.

The 2011 version .. Great Clarity of tone and overall a smoother feel to the track ..
A noticeable deftness and delicay in the playing .. lovely bends .. like the long sustained bend and the little double stops or are they harmonics ?? which you've dotted throughout the piece..... nice touches anyway .

I'd have been real pleased to have turned out either track tbh ...both have merits and are well executed. :thumbsup:
"Death is just a heartbeat away"
lyric from "Out in The Fields"
Gary Moore 1952-2011
User avatar
VikingBlues
Posts: 4466
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:44 pm

Re: Less is More or Less

Post by VikingBlues »

Thanks Strummer - for the listening and the comments. :D

I've hugely enjoyed those two years BTW!!! :clap: :clap: :clap:

The original is one of those (very few :sad: ) standout recordings that represent some sort of peak or new level being achieved. As such it is a tough job to try to better them - and being different is the most likely result at best. Though I'll admit I had another shot at a recording of it last night and .... boy, was that badly affected my mood, and I hastily destroyed the evidence this morning as soon as I woke .... different - yes, but absolutely horrible too.

I think you're right - technique is better on the new one and feel / emotion better on the original. :thumbsup:
An improv a day keeps the demons at bay!
User avatar
Blindboy
Posts: 1787
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2010 3:34 pm

Re: Less is More or Less

Post by Blindboy »

Two years... :cool:
Been some good music and some good times here on 12bar in the last two years. :D
I like both versions. They do show a progression in skill and confidence, as well as an evolution in tone and recording capability.I will go along with the consensus that the original has a "feel" that the new version lacks. I guess bringing all the elements together; feel, emotion, technique, tone, etc... and doing it EVERY time is what makes a pro. :roll: I kind of like how each version of a tune that I play has something else to say. Never the same way twice. (for good or ill :whistle: )
"Throw yo' big leg over me Mama, I might not feel this good again!"
MichaelRobinson
Posts: 2172
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2011 10:20 pm

Re: Less is More or Less

Post by MichaelRobinson »

I'm not so good at English so I say this in few words.

I like the old one best. Litle fuzzy. If I have some to remark on is that it would be even better without the delay.
I'm the type how eat fuzzy things.

The new one was well done but to clear in tone for my ears. I have listnen to other songs you made and notist that you prefer clear tone and you do it well.
But it's not my cup of tea.

Overall; Well done :music2:
User avatar
weelie
Posts: 228
Joined: Wed Apr 07, 2010 10:23 am

Re: Less is More or Less

Post by weelie »

great idea! Haven't heard either take, could you post just the backing, so i can listen to that alone first?
User avatar
VikingBlues
Posts: 4466
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:44 pm

Re: Less is More or Less

Post by VikingBlues »

Thanks guys for listening and taking the time to comment. :thumbsup:
MichaelRobinson wrote:II have listnen to other songs you made and notist that you prefer clear tone
I can quite understand why the reaction is to favour the original version and I'm glad it's liked. :thumbsup: But my tone has been gradually getting more and more towards clean by choice these last two years - and I don't think this is a BT that goes that well with a clean tone. :roll:

I'm afraid that try as I might, 'Venting Spleen', being a rare exception, I can't help but dislike the sounds I make when the guitar is cranked up and overdriven. Though I still enjoy hearing others playing with overdrive - odd that. :think: .... maybe I need a boutique overdrive pedal, or maybe I just need to work harder on playing around with settings for a sound I like more.

Blindboy said recently he played jazzy stuff like a blues player. I have the feeling I play everything as a melodic (for want of a better word) guitar player. That suits modal stuff and the gentle end of the musical spectrum but it doesn't quite work with the harder-edged blues, and it also doesn't properly tick all the boxes in the jazzy stuff (that needs lots of knowledge of chords, progressions, construction of a song etc). To be honest I will admit to feeling a bit of a fraud here sometimes, posting up work pretending I can do blues. :big_smile:
Blindboy wrote:I kind of like how each version of a tune that I play has something else to say. Never the same way twice. (for good or ill :whistle: )
I wouldn't want it any other way - the thought of trying to, or having to, play the same piece in exactly the same way every time fills me with horror.
weelie wrote:could you post just the backing, so i can listen to that alone first?
I've put a copy on box.net - the backing track section might not be appropriate for a cover BT like this.
http://www.box.com/s/cu8em6ezlj219u90b07s
An improv a day keeps the demons at bay!
User avatar
weelie
Posts: 228
Joined: Wed Apr 07, 2010 10:23 am

Re: Less is More or Less

Post by weelie »

I really prefer the new one. I guess it's partly the tone that glues my ears to the headphones with that take. It sounds so sweet and liquid, velvet smooth.
User avatar
vancouverois
Posts: 922
Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2010 5:55 pm

Re: Less is More or Less

Post by vancouverois »

After listening to the two versions, I slightly prefer the first one.
The new one is quite airy and nice but the first sounds a bit more raw, may is it due to the humbuckers
vs the P90 or the different tonelabs.
Both versions are quite good though, but we all know this tune played with an overdriven sound, it may have
some influence too.
Jan 15th 2007
User avatar
VikingBlues
Posts: 4466
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 7:44 pm

Re: Less is More or Less

Post by VikingBlues »

weelie wrote:I really prefer the new one. I guess it's partly the tone that glues my ears to the headphones with that take. It sounds so sweet and liquid, velvet smooth.
:D Thanks weelie - I find myself getting caught up in just the tones from the PRS and its P90s - unfortunately sometimes at the expense of the musical creativity.
vancouveris wrote:The new one is quite airy and nice but the first sounds a bit more raw, may is it due to the humbuckers
vs the P90 or the different tonelabs.
Both versions are quite good though, but we all know this tune played with an overdriven sound, it may have
some influence too.
Good thinking - I think both the pups and the tonelabs have an effect. The Tonelab ST on the first version does colour the sound more, as do the humbuckers. The Tonelab LE lets much more of the guitars own sound through and when those are 'vintage' style Alnico II P90s it does mean a very clear. airy tone.I think too, unusually during recent weeks, I was feeling very mellow and calm when I recodred the new version - that mood will have had an effect too.

I hadn't heard the ZZ Top original when I encountered this BT and did the original improv - one of many famous songs I haven't heard! I've deliberately avoided listening to the original apart from a very brief first 30 seconds or so just after I'd done the recording a couple of years ago. You're right - it is very difficult to hear a version of something where you know the original well without your views being influenced by the original. I do usually steer clear of these BTs that are based on 'real' songs as I know I'll not be able to get near the technical standards or musical creativity of experienced professional musicians.
An improv a day keeps the demons at bay!
Post Reply