Hello, from Canada

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12bar
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Re: Hello, from Canada

Post by 12bar » Mon Nov 28, 2011 9:25 pm

DeepDrummer wrote:Check it out if you like at:
http://www.youtube.com/user/DeepDrummer?feature=mhee
:thumbsup: I'm just having fun browsing through your videos! :clap:

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DeepDrummer
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Re: Hello, from Canada

Post by DeepDrummer » Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:40 am

Fun is good. I really hope to make a better one from Thursday to Saturday when I will be left alone undisturbed here. I need a day or 2 to practice some of this new great stuff you kind folks have been suggesting first. Sliding down from the C to the B and on, sounds absolutely heavenly when used with the A Pentatonic Minor. Who'd have thunk it. Mind you my drumming is suffering a bit these days as I concentrate on the guitar (like I care). The bottom line is good or bad. I am having some fun!!
Music is in my Soul and the Blues Makes me whole.

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Strummer07
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Re: Hello, from Canada

Post by Strummer07 » Wed Nov 30, 2011 9:08 am

WElcome Deep D :wave:

You've found a good place to be for guitar and Blues talk !!

any insights into the dark arts :icon_whoknows: of "Drumming" and Rhythms , especially Blues rhythms will be most handy.
"Death is just a heartbeat away"
lyric from "Out in The Fields"
Gary Moore 1952-2011

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DeepDrummer
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Re: Hello, from Canada

Post by DeepDrummer » Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:01 pm

Thanks strummer07. I am doing a bit of that. I took a few drums lessons when young and then laid off it for 35 years or so and then got another instructor who was just a great university educated drummer who helped a lot but I learned most of it just from listening to music and playing along and watching the drummer. I know even myself right now have a tendency to watch the guitarists to try to figure out that end of it. Watch the drummer. Try to pick out what he/she is using to keep the time. The rest just makes it interesting while not overplaying. I always had a hard time counting and playing. I got my start in music on trumpet (for 7 or 8 years) but playing notes as laid out on a page is totally different than trying to make stuff up yourself as I think we all know. As a guitarist, it may be easier if you think of the bass part since drummers and bass players tend to feed off each other or so it seems. Regardless, you need to count it out. Primarily the drummers job is to keep the time somehow. The guitarist's job is more to use that time keeping to make the music shine without having to worry quite so much about counting. For instance somewhere in the last measure of a 12 bar blues, the drummer may do what is called a fill which accentuates the fact that it's time for the turnaround and to start the 12 bars over. Anything the guitarist can get from the drummer to keep in time will go a long way to supply what is required and it is not uncommon nor improper to ask the drummer and discuss in each song what part of the beat that will be. As long as there is something to mark the place in the song. One of the hardest things I had to get past was the fact that I always kept time on trumpet by tapping my right foot. This translated into 4 bass beats in each 4/4 measure (on drums) but to oversimplify, that is more of a rock type thing. Using the left foot on the high hat gives both visual and subtle audio clues as to where the time is and the fills accent the changes and tell you where 1 is while maintaining the sublety required to accompany and serve the Blues. We all need to know where the first beat of the bar is and what tempo to follow but we tend to speed up and slow down. Often the drummer is playing to the click so everyone else can just follow the drummer and have a clean mix in their ears. Something as simple as opening the hi hat hitting it and then closing it can be the time marker at the end of a progression. The point I am trying to make is that tapping with my right foot held me back on drums. I tell everyone now to keep the time with the left foot which frees up all the other limbs to do whatever you like such as off beats and such and this can be translated into what is programmed in drums machines and the like and somethign to look for in precanned available drum beats. Just stay away from the 4 on the floor (4 bass drum beats in a bar)rock beat when playing Blues. It does not serve the Blues well which required a softer, quieter approach gerneally though but there are some great upbeat Blues songs that require some good heavy playing. It's the drummers job to help the musicians shine and not the other way around in the Blues. Most drummers do not like to play Blues stuff since it doesn't give them enough to do and I myself struggle to control the urge to flail away. Nice and soft and steady with accents required only when it serves the music well was good advice given to me. Oh, and I can be happy playing a simple Blues beat all night long because I love the Blues. Alot of drummers will play what they don't like for the money but it shows right through in bored looking facial expressions and a lack of enthusiasm (not to be confused with volume and intensity). Personally, I Love the Blues on every instrument. I suppose I show that same lack of enthusiasm when playing rock as a Drummer who doesn't like the Blues will look like when playing. Oh man, I should have left my drum recording setup in place to demonstrate that as well. Another time. Drumming Blues is no different than playing Blues solos (as I am learning from the great folks here) in that Less can definitely be more. Watch the hi hat on some of the best drummers out there and ignore the rest and you'll see what I mean. Even during solos they keep that hi hat pulse so they themselves can keep in time without drilling that 4 on the floor into the crowd. But if the other members of the band request the drummer to hit the bell of the ride cymbal or (heaven forbid) the cowbell on the first beat of every bar to serve a particular song and help keep the time, then that is what the drummer should do. A wood block or a cross stick on the snare perhaps can be a real nice subtle timekeeping tool as well. It's kind of what YOU as a guitarist wants him to give you. It has to be a team effort and there are really no rules for a drummer other than to be on time and not play for themselves but to play for and serve the music and the band members. Now I'd be lying if I said they don't get a kick out of purposely controlling the tempo just for a power trip but they WILL respond appropriately if they get signaled to slow down or speed up. I have seen Blues Drummers play the same simple beat all night long and by doing this served the music very well. Nothing fancy, rarely using fills but just being rock solid all night long. Personally, that is how I look at a Blues Drummers duty and to emulate that, look for those simple things when making drum beats. Generally less is more in the Blues for sure. Which still at times can be played with intensity.
Check out the drummer who plays for Ana Popovic who tends to play a more upbeat dancable Blues style. He plays with an intensity that serves her music well but still nothing fancy and rock solid. Now that's a good drummer and musician. Slamming out double bass beats while crashing the snot out of cymbals and such has limited value in the Blues.
Listen to the drummer in your favourite Blues tunes and relate to how easy it is to find the beat regardless of how it it presented. As long as you can tap your foot to it, you're on the right track. It doesn't have to be on the beat and could be on the eighth notes between the beat. As long as everyone knows and agrees where they can look for the time, and it's not overplay, you can create a useful beat. It doesn't take an entire room full of drums. A bass and a snare can get the job done or a cajon or even as a lot of jazz people do. One single ride cymbal. Again. Less can very much be more. If your drummer gets all uppity, take a break and let him/her solo until they get their ya ya's out. Playing Blues on drums looks simple perhaps but it takes a lot of control not to overplay it and I am guilty as charged on that one. Good job I don't have band mates to come down on me. LOL.
Oh man, just got a call. My amp is repaired and ready to be picked up. Now THAT'S what I"M talkin' about!!!!! Sorry for the long winded post but I hope it helps clarify some things. Later.....
Music is in my Soul and the Blues Makes me whole.

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DeepDrummer
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Re: Hello, from Canada

Post by DeepDrummer » Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:08 pm

oops. I probably should have posted that somewhere else. Please forgive me. Gotta go!!!
A nice shuffle on the ride cymbal can serve 3/4 time well also. chinge but ta ching but ta ching...you know?
Music is in my Soul and the Blues Makes me whole.

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12bar
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Re: Hello, from Canada

Post by 12bar » Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:36 pm

It's OK here and contains some wise words! :thumbsup:

Maybe a line break here and there would it make easier to read... :think:

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Strummer07
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Lots of Good Info

Post by Strummer07 » Wed Nov 30, 2011 6:25 pm

Thanks for taking time out to post all of that DeepD
Real helpful stuff .....to a complete Drum Numpty :icon_whoknows:

Just knowing NOT to bash out the beat on a snare drum 4/4 style .and to use the much more subtle left footed ride cymbal, is a great place to start.

The basic Drum clip ( On the Drum thread ) is also very helpful, to be able to see what is being hit and when. Your camera is well postioned to "see" whats happening ....at most shows its often quite hard to actually see the drummer as they are pretty much encased in Drums / cymbals / and mics

I've used a wooden block for a while now, even with a full BT ... it helps me keep time and focus on beat 1 .... I lay it down a a seprate "Click" track right at the start of recording ...even then I can go out of time remerkably easily !!

Many thanks ......I shall see what delights, fills and paradiddles I can conjuer up on my drum machine !! :dance:
"Death is just a heartbeat away"
lyric from "Out in The Fields"
Gary Moore 1952-2011

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